Friday, February 21, 2025

Who did Abhimanyu kill?

Intro - The point of this post is not to highlight abhimanyu's power or give him a respect thread but instead the objective is for me to give a list of names for the characters that he killed.
Also i will start by listing the casualties for the 13th day after that it'll be back in time to day 1 until day eleven to see who he slayed.

On day 13.
Quote 1:
"Then with three other shafts of great sharpness, the mighty son of Arjuna, excited with rage, slew those three warriors, Sushena, Drighalochana, and Kundavedhin."
Quote 2:
"The younger brother of Salya, filled with wrath, advanced against Abhimanyu, scattering his shafts. Arjuna's son however endued with great lightness of hand, cut off his antagonist's head and charioteer, his triple bamboo-pole, his bed (on the car), his car-wheels, his yoke, and shafts and quiver, and car-bottom, by means of his arrows."
"So quick were his movements that none could obtain a sight of his person. Deprived of life, that foremost and chief of all ornaments of battle fell down on the earth, like a huge hill uprooted by a mighty tempest."
Quote 3:
"Then Abhimanyu, forcibly bending the bow and smiling the while, with one winged arrow cut off his antagonist's head. That head, severed from the trunk, fell down on the earth. Beholding his brother slain and overthrown, like a Karnikara tree shaken and thrown down by the wind from the mountain top, Karna, O monarch, was filled with pain."
[foster brother of karn]
Quote 4:
"Cased though he was in an iron coat of mail, the son of Subhadra pierced him in the chest with a far-reaching shaft. Thereupon Vasatiya fell down on the earth, deprived of life. Beholding Vasatiya slain, many bulls among Kshatriyas became filled with wrath, and surrounded thy grandson, O king, from a desire of slaying him."
Quote 5:
"Phalguni's son, however, cutting off his bow, his right and left arms, and his head adorned with beautiful eyes and eye-brows quickly felled them on the earth. Beholding Rukmaratha, the honoured son of Salya, slain by the illustrious son of Subhadra."

Quote 6:
"many princely friends of Salya's son, O king, accomplished in smiting and incapable of being easily defeated in battle, and owning standards decked with gold, (came up for the fight). Those mighty car-warriors, stretching their bows full six cubits long, surrounded the son of Arjuna, all pouring their arrowy showers upon him."
"Those hundred princes were slain and felled by Subhadra's son like a tope of five-year old mango-trees just on the point of bearing fruit (laid low by a tempest). Beholding those youthful princes brought up in every luxury, and resembling angry snakes of virulent poison, all slain by the single-handed Abhimanyu, Duryodhana was filled with fear."

Who Abhimanyu killed before laxman;
"After Duryodhana was beaten back and a hundred princes slain, what course was pursued by the warriors of my army against the son of Subhadra?"
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Quote 7
"That shaft, sped by Abhimanyu's arms, cut off the beautiful head, decked with ear-rings, of Lakshmana, that was graced with a beautiful nose, beautiful eye-brows, and exceedingly good-looking curls. Beholding Lakshmana slain, thy troops uttered exclamations."
Quote 8:
"The latter's bow and shafts, and bracelets, and arms, and head decked with diadem, and umbrella, and standard, and charioteer, and steeds, were all cut off and felled by Abhimanyu. When Kratha's son, possessed of nobility of lineage, good behaviour, acquaintance with the scriptures, great strength, fame, and power of arms, was slain, the other heroic combatants almost all turned away."
Quote 9:
The mighty Abhimanyu, then, in the very sight of thy heroic sons, slew the brave Vrindaraka, that enhancer of the fame of the Kurus. While Abhimanyu was thus engaged in fearlessly slaying one after another the foremost warriors among his enemies
Quote 10
"Ruler of the Kosalas, then, thus deprived of his car, took up a sword and wished to sever from Abhimanyu's trunk his beautiful head, decked with ear-rings. Abhimanyu then pierced king Vrihadvala, the ruler of the Kosalas, in the chest, with a strong arrow. The latter then, with riven heart, fell down. Beholding this, ten thousand illustrious kings broke and fled. Those kings, armed with swords and bows, fled away"

"The son of Subhadra then slew six of Karna's brave counsellors, conversant with all modes of warfare, with their steeds and charioteers and cars."
"Slaying next the son of the ruler of the Magadhas, Abhimanyu, with six straight shafts, slew the youthful Aswaketu with his four steeds and charioteer."

"Then slaying, with a sharp razor-headed arrow, the Bhoja prince of Martikavata, bearing the device of an elephant (on his banner), the son of Arjuna uttered a loud shout and began to scatter his shafts on all sides."
"Abhimanyu then slew five warriors., named Satrunjaya, and Chandraketu, and Mahamegba, and Suvarchas, and Suryabhasa."

"Then that hero pressed Suvala's son, Kalikeya, down into the earth, and stew seven and seventy Gandhara followers of the latter. Next, he slew ten car-warriors of the Brahma-Vasatiya race, and then ten huge elephants."

Complete list (13th day).
1 - Suvarchas
2 - Suryabhasa
3 - Satrunjaya
4 - Chandraketu
5 - Mahamegba
6 - Kalikeya
7 - Martikavata's prince (descendant of same Citrarath who parshuram's mother renuka lusted after)

8 - Aswaketu
9 - Prince of magada.
10 - Vrihadvalh (king of Ram's land Koshal)
11 - karna's foster brother (adhirath putra)
12 - Vrindaraka
13 - son of Kratha
14 - Laxman
15 - Vasatiya
16 - Rukmarath
17 - Drighalochan
18 - Shalya's brother
19 - Kundavedhin
20 - Sushena
Bonus would be the 6 counselor's of hijda Karna & 100 kshatriya rajkumars that were friend's of Rukmaratha.

Who Kratha was?
[Quote]
"Then Bhima, without losing a moment, despatched Kratha to the abode of Yama, with a long arrow of keen point. Deprived of life, that prince fell down on the Earth."
[End]
Logic - Kratha was Duryodhana's brother, his son would be a nephew to Duryodhana & a grandson of Dhritrashtra.
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Cross reference;
[Quote]
"Abhimanyu, he, having slain many thousands of men and steeds and elephants, and eight thousand cars, and once more nine hundred elephants, two thousand princes, and a large number of heroic warriors unknown to fame, and despatching in that battle king Vrihadvala also to heaven, at last, through ill luck, met with his own death. Thus hath occurred this event that so enhances our grief! That tiger among men hath even thus ascended to heaven!"
Logic - this indicates that he killed over 11 thousand warriors that day not a full aukshouni, half a aukshouni or 3/4ths of one. But its confirmed that at minimum 2 thousand of his victims were royal princes.
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Now i will discuss who he slew on days 2 to 11.
I already read his performance on day 1, though he fought well he didn't slay a important warrior that day.

2nd day: he did not kill any great names. In this chapter link its stated many kings arrived with duryodhana to fight abhimanyu but all of them get killed by arjuna instead of abhimanyu (according to sanjaya) - https://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m06/m06055.htm If you are to be realistic then maybe it can be assumed that sanjaya made a mistake or did not see all that happened so possibly one of those kings indeed got killed by abhimanyu instead of arjuna.

Day 3 - random nameless warriors belonging to sakuni's legion were murdered by abhimanyu.
Quote;
"Satyaki, abandoning that car of his, speedily mounted on Abhimanyu's car, O chastiser of foes. And those two, mounted on the same car, then began to speedily slaughter the army of Suvala's son with straight arrows of sharp points."
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On day 4's early half it was mentioned that abhimanyu afflicted the kourav army but not whether he killed someone or not.
Quote;
"And seeing thy grandson, O king, thus afflicting thy host, thy warriors, O monarch, surrounded him on all sides. Then that smiter of foes, the son of Subhadra, depending upon his prowess and might, advanced with undepressed heart against the Dhartarashtra host. And while battling with the foe in that conflict, his mighty bow endued with the effulgence of the sun, was seen by all to be incessantly stretched for striking. And piercing the son of Drona with one shaft, and Salya with five, he overthrew the standard of Samyamani's son with eight shafts. And with another sharp-edged arrow he cut off the mighty dart of golden staff, resembling a snake, that was hurled at him by Somadatta's son. And the heir of Arjuna, baffling in the very sight of Salya, his hundreds of terrible shafts, slew his four steeds. Thereupon Bhurisravas, and Salya, and Drona's son and Samyamani, and Sala struck with the fear at the strength of arms displayed by Krishna's son could not stay before him."
Logic - here i removed the text which said said 'p. 158' also Sanjaya refers to abhimanyu as a grandson of dhritrashtra instead of pandu.

4th day ending.
{Passage}
"The ruler of the Magadhas, in that battle, urged his elephant resembling Airavata himself, towards the car of Subhadra's son. Beholding that mighty elephant advancing towards him, that slayer of hostile heroes, the brave son of Subhadra, slew it with a single shaft. And when the ruler of the Magadhas was thus deprived of his elephant, that conqueror of hostile cities, the son of Krishna, then struck off that king's head with a broad-headed shaft with silver wings."
Note: son of krishna here meant son of arjuna because he had another name like Krishna.
Krishna said: "Seven days have elapsed since the mighty Jayatsena, the ruler of the Magadhas, was slain in battle by Abhimanyu."
[end]
Comment - it could mean day 10 or even day 9.

Cross-reference:
[begin]
The mighty Jayatsena the son of Jarasandha, the prince of the Magadhas, O king, hath been slain in battle by the high-souled son of Subhadra."
[done]
Overall its unclear whether Jayatsena was a prince or king, its also not made clear whether his death was on day four, nine or ten.
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Day 5;
"Satyaki and Chekitana, and the mighty son of Subhadra, proceeded against Salya and the Kaikeyas."
Logic - shalya dies cause of yudisther & the only 2 relevant kekaya warriors (vinda/anuvinda) were murdered by satyaki later. So clearly their killer isn't abhimanyu. All he does here is fight and injure not murder or slay.

Passage:
"Then the princes of thy army, all heroic and mighty car-warriors, excited with wrath and united together in that conflict, pierced him with sharp arrows. And Abhimanyu, acquainted with the mightiest weapons, smote them all with keen shafts. Beholding that feat of his, thy sons then surrounded the son of Arjuna, who was consuming thy army in that conflict like a swelling fire of blazing flames consuming a heap of dry grass in summer."
Explanation: Here a case can be made for important royalty being slaughtered by him except their names had not been given by Sanjaya, Souti, Vyaas, Vaisampayan etc. But the term consuming alludes to carnage.
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Day 6;
"Yudhishthira the just, disposing all his own divisions properly despatched twelve mighty car-warriors including Abhimanyu and others to follow Bhimasena behind."

Day 7 - apart from his location in the army mode nothing much is mentioned of abhimanyu's actions that day, so him killing a relevant character or monarch is unlikely.

8th day - here abhimanyu defeated king Amvastha but himself did a group attack on Bhagadatta which led to him losing to bhagadatta, not a single character had been slain by abhimanyu today.
Quote;
"Abhimanyu also, with his shafts, deprived that renowned and foremost of car-warriors, viz., king Amvashta, of his car. Deprived of his car and about to be slain by the celebrated son of Subhadra, that king quickly jumped down from his car."
Logic - maybe abhimanyu killed his driver but its confirmed that this king did not die.

9th day:
"Death-dealing shafts, O king, shot by him in that battle, despatched many heroic Kshatriyas to the regions of the king of the departed spirits. Indeed, excited with wrath Subhadra's son in that battle shot fierce and blazing arrows in profusion that resembled snakes of virulent poison or rods of death himself. And Phalguni's son speedily split into fragments car-warriors with their cars, steeds with their riders, and elephant-warriors along with the huge animals they rode."
"And the rulers of the earth, filled with joy, applauded those mighty feats in battle and praised him also that achieved them. And the son of Subhadra, O Bharata, tossed those divisions (of the Kaurava army) like the tempest tossing a heap of cotton on all sides in the welkin. Routed by him, O Bharata, the troops failed to find a protector, like elephants sunk in a slough. Then, O best of men, having routed all troops, Abhimanyu stood, O king, like a blazing fire without a curl of smoke."
Size of a division: "25,000 foot-soldiers proceeded towards Partha and surrounded him. Then that mighty car-warrior amongst the Pancalas with Bhimasena at his head, speedily slew that brave division and stood triumphant." https://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m09/m09003.htm

The driver of Chitrasena died:
"Son of Subhadra, having slain his antagonist's steeds and charioteer with nine arrows, uttered a loud shout. Thereupon that mighty car-warrior, (viz., Chitrasena), quickly jumping down from that car whose steed had been slain, mounted, O king, without delay, the car of Durmukha."
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Day 10.
Suyodhana's quote;
"Satyaki, and Chekitana, and the twin sons of Madri, and the valiant Abhimanyu,--these also are routing my troops."

11th day.
He kills the charioteer of paurava king (ancestor to porus):
"Mounting next upon his car, he seized Paurava by the hair, and slaying meanwhile with a kick, the latter's driver, he felled his standard with a stroke of his sword. And as regards Paurava himself, Abhimanyu raised him up, like the Garuda raising a snake from the bottom of the sea agitating the waters."
That ends it all now.
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List:
1 - Jayatsena
2 - driver of king Amvastha
3 - charioteer of prince Chitrasena
4 - nameless warriors
5 - multiple divisions (each consisted of 25 thousand men)
6 - sarathi of king paurava.
The reason i am not including day 12 is cause its made obviously clear he did not kill anyone during that day in particular.
Puzzle:
- Name of Kundavedhin (murdered by Abhimanyu) has only one difference with the brother of Duryodhan whose name is Kundabhedin. That is the v & b so it is possible he was the same brother of Duryodhan that Bheem pledged to kill. Possibly the person who abhimanyu killed was actually a son of kundavedhin instead so a upa kourava who shared the name of his father/sire.

Overall abhimanyu is highly underestimated by bhishma tards & karna bhakts. But whats more important is that he has a higher list of kills/casualties than both karna/bhishma combined. Naming even four people killed by either bhishma or karna is difficult but naming abhimanyus casualties is not hard at all.
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Sunday, February 16, 2025

Yavanas are not Greek

Explanation - Their have been claims for years that Greek meant "Yavan" in the sanskrit language or at the very least the clan of yavanas (mentioned in Ramayan/Mahabharat) were actually ancient greek people. In my opinion this's a false claim that originated out of ignorance.

Post begin's;
The 1st time these people were mentioned is in Ramayan's Bala Kanda when Vishwamitra's tale had been narrated at that point a cow under the ownership of Vashisth somehow used magic to spawn or bring to life a race called "Yavana" they also receive mention in adi parva of mahabharat.

{Quote}
"On seeing the subdual of hundreds of Pahlava-s by Vishvamitra, then the Sacred Cow again generated deadly Shaka-s hobnobbed with Yavana-s through her mooing."
Mahabharat passage:
"From her womb, an army of Yavanas, and from her dung, an army of Savaras; and from her urine, an army of Kanchis; and from her sides, an army of Savaras. And from the froth of her mouth came out hosts of Paundras and Kiratas, Yavanas and Sinhalas, and the barbarous tribes of Khasas and Chivukas and Pulindas and Chinas and Hunas with Keralas, and numerous other Mlechchhas."
Logic - the cow had magic that resulted in the summoning of yavanas. But its not made clear whether these were the first yavanas in existence or if their were never any yavana warriors before the incident in this verse.

Cross reference during kurukshetra suggested they were born out of a cow;
"And many terrible Yavanas and Paradas and Sakas and Valhikas, and Mlecchas born of the cow (belonging to Vasishtha), of fierce eyes, accomplished in smiting looking like messengers of Death, and all conversant with the deceptive powers of the Asuras."
Logic - even if the text in parenthesis gets removed still the word 'COW' got mentioned outside of it, so it has to be genuine not a interpolation.
Shishir Parvaath
[quote]
"You strive hard in the island of Yava, which will be splendorous with seven kingdoms, like that even in Golden and Silver islands that are enwreathed with gold-mines, in and around Yava islands. On crossing over Yava Island, there is a mountain named Shishira, which touches heaven with its peak, and which gods and demons adore. You shall collectively rake through all the impassable mountains, waterfalls, and forests in these islands for the glorious wife of Rama."
[end]
Comment; it is entirely possible that the YAVANAS came from here and not greece, its more likely for them to be from a island close to India's proximity like Yava.
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Mini respect Thread for kalyavana.
Fought Sri Krishna to a standstill even making him back off;
[quote]
"Seeing his army killed, that mighty Kālayavana, the lord of Yavanas, fought with Kṛṣṇa, with a mace. Seeing that great havoc (done) by him for a long time, the lotus-eyed Kṛṣṇa too, turning away from the battle, retreated. (Kālayavana) very speedily followed him."
[finish]
                            Image is of Nikitin Dheer in the role of Kalyavana.
Of course apart from this theirs no achievement of Kaalyavan but it can be assumed he was a gada-dhaari so he preferred doing club warfare/mace-combat. I dont know if krishna just pretended to lose by slackening his attack on purpose or if his defeat was genuine. The reason being cause even though krishna was an avatar of Vishnu he still was not infallible, his power is inferior to his source (vishnu himself) & he has shown that he has limited power multiple times.
Like on day 12 (Kurukshetra) when he was knocked out due to the weapon of a samsaptaka warrior. Also krishna had made love with many spouses this action depleted his internal reservoir of spirit energy cause of the amount of intercourse he had in life.

ReaLife athlete's quote;
"While not strictly adhering to celibacy, Ali believed in conserving energy during training and fight preparations."
So although krishna was powerful he remained inferior to the other avatars of vishnu and was himself vulnerable to many people.
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What MB (Mahabharat) say's about yavana origins.
1st:
[begin]
"The sons of Turvasu have come to be called the Yavanas."
[done]
Note - Turvasu is the name of a Kshatriya caste king in arya varth. Turvasu was the second son to "Yayati" an earlier king of aryans.
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A character with a unique name:
"In this region, O Brahmana, Manu and Yavakrita's son together set a limit which Surya can never overstep."
Logic - notice that the word 'yava' is in it, that shows a similarity with yavana, so most likely the original meaning of yava was not greek, foreigner, mleccha etc.
=
Also i think that its worth noting that Ravan had a family member called "Malyavan" but nowhere did anyone consider him a mleccha, foreigner, barbarian or greek/macedonian.

Real-sanskrit verse;
{begin}
parivR^ittaakSaH = rolling his eyes; dmarSaat = in fury; abraviit = spoke; atha = then; maalyavantam = to Malyavan
{completed}
Here his name was referenced as "Malyavantam" instead of Malyavan.

Verse 15;
maalyavaan = Malyavan
Here they got his name correct, but still my main point is that the phrase/term [yavan] is within his name yet hes not considered a foreigner, mleccha or greek.
So yavanas most likely were not greeks or macedonians or europeans.
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Saturday, February 15, 2025

Ashwathama vs Ghatotkaca

Obviously this post is dedicated to analyzing the fight between these 2 characters from a unbiased angle but i choose to also upload 1 edited image of ashwathama (using the face of Chopra's actor as a base) wearing armor, just to test my editing skills.

For the quotes i will rely solely on KMG mahabharat not bori ce, gita press, dakshinatya, indonesian MB or kashidasi.
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Their very 1st battle was on day eight.
Quote:
"He then struck the chariot of Vivingsati and Aswatthaman. These fell down on the front of their cars, relinquishing the reins of the steeds. With another crescent-shaped shaft he overthrew the standard of Jayadratha bearing the device of a boar and decked with gold. And with a second arrow he cut off the latter's bow. And with eyes red in wrath, he slew with four shafts the four steeds of the high-souled king of Avanti. And with another arrow, O king, well-tempered and sharp, and shot from his bow drawn to its fullest stretch, he pierced king Vrihadvala. Deeply pierced and exceedingly pained, the latter sat down on the terrace of his car."
Event's made simple - bhishma orders people including Ashwathama to protect Duryodhan from ghatotkaca, seeing him approach ghatotkaca chose to hit him with arrows, ashwathama failed to retaliate & counter attack.

After this Yudisther told Bhima to lead a contingent of warriors to accompany or help Ghatotkaca because in his POV (point of view) Ghatotkaca was slowly losing the fight:
"Those mighty car-warriors, drawing their bows that measured full six cubits long, and uttering loud roars like a herd of lions, all rushed together against that single warrior. And surrounding him on all sides, they covered him with their arrowy showers like the clouds covering the mountain-breast with torrents of rain in autumn. Deeply pierced with those arrows and much pained, he resembled then an elephant pierced with the hook. Quickly then he soared up into the firmament like Garuda. And (while there) he uttered many loud roars like the autumnal clouds, making the welkin and all the points of the compass, cardinal and subsidiary, resounded with those fierce cries."
Logic - but in my opinion even if he was losing then still its not embarrassing because ghatotkaca was alone against a group of many people, ashwathama did a group attack like a coward.

Round 2:
"Beholding king Nila, who looked like a mass of blue clouds, in a swoon, Ghatotkacha, filled with wrath and surrounded by his kinsmen, rushed impetuously towards Drona's son, that ornament of battle. Similarly many other Rakshasas, incapable of being easily defeated in battle, rushed at Aswatthaman. Beholding then that Rakshasa of terrible mien coming towards him, the valiant son of Bharadwaja impetuously rushed towards him. Filled with wrath he slew many Rakshasas of formidable visage, that is, those wrathful ones amongst them who were in Ghatotkacha's van. Beholding them repulsed from the encounter by means of the shafts shot from the bow of Drona's son, Bhimasena's son Ghatotkacha of gigantic size was filled with rage. He then exhibited a fierce and awful illusion. Therewith that prince of the Rakshasas, endued with extraordinary powers of illusion, confounded the son of Drona in that battle."
Logic; the incident here is extremely difficult to decipher/understand. A list of nameless rakshasas were also with ghatotkaca, they had been killed in ways undescribed or not narrated by Sanjaya. I suppose that Ashwathama should be hailed for being able to slay multiple warriors infront of ghatotkaca. But after their deaths the thing is Ghatotkaca used a magic trick which is confusing.
Did ashwathama lose?
{Begin}
All thy troops, in consequence of that illusion, turned their backs upon the field. They beheld one another cut down and lying prostrate on the surface of the earth, writhing convulsively, perfectly helpless, and bathed in blood. Drona and Duryodhana and Salya and Aswatthaman, and other great bowmen that were regarded as foremost among the Kauravas, also seemed to fly away. All the car-warriors seemed to be crushed, and all the kings seemed to be slain. And horses and horse-riders seemed to be cut down in thousands. Beholding all this, thy troops fled away towards their tents. And although, O king, both myself and Devavrata cried out at the top of our voices, saying "Fight, do not fly away, all this is Rakshasa illusion in battle, applied by Ghatotkacha." Yet they stopped not, their senses having been confounded. Although both of us said so, still struck with panic, they gave no credit to our words.
{End}
Logic - i believe that Ghatotkaca manifested a illusionary/fake scene of drona & ashwathama running away, which is possible cause if he is able to use magic to produce rakshasas then he should also be capable of manifesting fake clones of ashwathama/drona. The same way Ravan created fake clones of laxman/raam in vana parva of mahabharat (according to Markandeya).

In the following chapter the above incident was considered a loss by Duryodhan himself, but what readers do not understand is that he had to accept defeat because his army fled from the field not cause a warrior lost. One clue is that the real Drona was mentioned fighting a different character but for Ashwathama's character their was unfortunately no mention of his actions after the magic trick of Ghatotkaca. So in conclusion Ghatotkaca probably defeated ashwathama (cause no action of ashwathama is mentioned afterwards) but not Drona.
SCORE BOARD - Ghatotkaca forced ashwathama to retreat 2 times, ashwathama failed.
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Important point to be noted;
During the conversation between ghatotkaca & ashwathama (night 14) he called ghatotkaca the word "son" affectionately. This not only showed that ashwathama had no discrimination/bias in his heart for rakshasas but it also showed his positive nature and qualities. It was before drona's death so its before ashwathama's heart went dark & he became a negative villain type character. Since ashwathama was pro pandava (but fought for kauravas) a theory can be made that on day 8 he purposely decided to not use his full power against Ghatotkaca which is why he lost against him during day time.
=
The 14th night is when they have their next meeting between eachother.

Background quote:
"Then in the very sight of Karna, of Aswatthaman, of Duryodhana, of Kripa, of Somadatta, and of Valhika, the son of Pandu, that chastiser of foes, by a stamp of his foot, caused that car of the heroic Durmada and Dushkarna to sink into the earth."
Note - this quote is placed here to show what ashwathama was doing before his fight vs Ghatotkaca, while guru Drona defeated Ghatotkaca before the ashwathama vs ghatotkaca fight it seems like their was nothing relevant done by ashwathama this night before he faced Ghatotkaca. So Ghatotkaca began his duel (vs Ashwathama) being injured while Ashwathama started out fresh.

Ghatotkaca moved to challenge Ashwathama:
"Seeing him rush in that battle against the car of Sini's grandson, Bhimasena's son, the gigantic Rakshasa, Ghatotkacha, endued with great strength, rushed at him, riding on a huge and terrible car made of black iron covered with bear-skins."

Battle begin's;
"Only the proud son of Drona, ever boastful of his might in arms, stood fearlessly. And he soon dispelled that illusion that had been created by Ghatotkacha. Upon the destruction of his illusion, Ghatotkacha in rage sped fierce shafts (Aswatthaman). These pierced the son of Drona, like angry snakes speedily piercing through an ant-hill. Those arrows, having pierced through the body of Aswatthaman, dyed with blood and quickly entered the earth."
Logic; Here the different rakshasas on the field & the other beasts were considered to be merely illusions (not-real-creatures-or-being's), which is why when they die then Sanjaya referred to their deaths as "a illusion dispelled"

Ashwathama's counter-attack;
"Aswatthaman, however, of great prowess, filled with wrath, pierced Ghatotkacha with ten arrows. Ghatotkacha, deeply pierced in his vital parts by Drona's son, and feeling great pain, took up a wheel having a thousand spokes. Its edge was sharp as a razor, and it was resplendent as the rising sun. And it was decked with diverse gems and diamonds. Desirous of slaying him, the son of Bhimasena hurled that wheel at Aswatthaman. And as that wheel coursed swiftly towards Drona's son, the latter cut it into fragments by means of his shafts. Baffled, it fell down on the earth, like the hope cherished by an unfortunate man."
"Beholding his wheel baffled, Ghatotkacha quickly covered the son of Drona with his shafts, like Rahu swallowing the sun. Meanwhile, Ghatotkacha's son endued with great splendour and looking like a mass of antimony, checked the advancing son of Drona like the king of mountain checking the wind. Afflicted with showers of shafts by Bhimasena's grandson, the brave Anjanaparvan, Aswatthaman looked like the mountain Meru bearing a torrent of rain from a mighty cloud."
Logic - I removed the parenthesis-text and the page number to make it easier to read. But clearly in this round its Ashwathama who had the upper hand against Ghatotkaca.
SCORE-BOARD; Ashwathama has 1 point but Ghatotkaca maintains 2 points [due to his victory on day 8].

AnjanParva Mrityu:
"With one shaft he cut off the standard of Anjanaparvan. With two others, his two drivers, and with three others, his Trivenuka. And he cut off the Rakshasa's bow with one arrow, and his four steeds with four other arrows. Made carless, Anjanaparvan took up a scimitar. With another keen shaft, Aswatthaman cut off in two fragments that scimitar, decked with golden stars, in the Rakshasa's hand. The grandson of Hidimva then, O king, whirling a gold adorned mace, quickly hurled it at Aswatthaman. Drona's son, however, striking it with his shafts, caused it to fall down on the earth. Soaring up then into the sky, Anjanaparvan began to roar like a cloud. And from the welkin he showered trees upon his foe."
"Like the sun piercing a mass of clouds with his rays, Aswatthaman then began to pierce with his shafts the son of Ghatotkacha, that receptacle of illusions, in the welkin. Gifted with great energy, the Rakshasa once more came down on his gold decked car. He then looked like a high and beautiful hill of antimony on the surface of the earth. The son of Drona then slew that son of Bhima's son, Anjanaparvan, cased in an iron coat of mail, even as Mahadeva had slain in days of yore the Asura Andhaka. Beholding his mighty son slain by Aswatthaman, Ghatotkacha, coming unto the son of Drona, fearlessly addressed the heroic son of Saradwata's daughter, who was then consuming the Pandava troops like a raging forest-conflagration, in these words."
Comment - I wonder why ghatotkatch stood silently as a mute spectator while his innocent unpopular son fought bravely? Regardless this moment counts as a embarassment for Ghatotkaca but it is not a defeat because the person who ashwathama dueled is ghatotkaca's son not ghatotkaca himself.

They fight again;
"Ghatotkacha began to shower upon that bull among car-warriors, Drona'sson, shafts of the measure of Aksha of battle car, like a cloud pouring torrents of rain. Drona's son however, with his own shafts, checked that arrowy shower before it could reach him. At that time, it seemed that another encounter was taking place in the welkin between shafts (as the combatants). The welkin, then, during the night, shone resplendent with the sparks caused by the clash of those weapons, as if with (myriads of) flies. Observing that his illusion was dispelled by Drona's son, proud of his prowess in battle, Ghatotkacha, once more making himself invisible, created an illusion. He assumed the form of a high mountain, crowded with cliffs and trees, and possessing fountains from which ceaselessly flowed spears and lances and swords and heavy clubs. Beholding that mountain-like mass of antimony, with countless weapons falling from it, Drona's son was not at all moved. The latter invoked into existence the Vajra weapon. The prince of mountains, then, struck with that weapon, was quickly destroyed."
"Then the Rakshasa, becoming a mass of blue clouds in the firmament, decked with rainbow, began furiously to shower upon Drona's son in that battle a downpour of stones and rocks. Then that foremost of all persons acquainted with weapons,  Aswatthaman, aiming the Vayavya weapon, destroyed that blue cloud which had risen on the firmament. Drona's son, that foremost of men, covering then all the points of the compass with his shafts, slew a hundred thousand car-warriors. He then beheld Ghatotkacha fearlessly coming towards him with bent bow and accompanied by a large number of Rakshasas that resembled lions or infuriated elephants of great strength, some riding on elephants, some on cars, and some on steeds. The son of Hidimva was accompanied by those fierce followers of his, with frightful faces and heads and necks. Those Rakshasas consisted of both Paulastyas and Yatudhanas. Their prowess was equal to that of Indra himself. They were armed with diverse kinds of weapons and were cased in diverse kinds of armour. Of terrible visage, they swelled with rage. Ghatotkacha came to battle, accompanied by those Rakshasas, who were, indeed, incapable of being easily defeated in battle. Beholding them, thy son, Duryodhana, became exceedingly cheerless."
Comment - after this ashwathama had a conversation with duryodhan, so whatever ghatotkaca was doing during that time period had not been reported (to dhritrashtra or any audience) by sanjaya.
SCORE BOARD stayed the same here.

Though ghatotkaca was clearly being overpowered/beaten the fact is he had not run away yet so the outcome of this fight is undecided so far. Whats interesting is that the narrative here states ghatotkaca killed over 100,000 warrior's, that might lead readers to believe maybe ghatotkaca was doing a group attack against him.
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Continuation;
Ghatotkacha, filled with rage, struck Drona's son in the chest with ten powerful shafts fierce as poison or fire. Deeply pierced with those shafts by the son of Bhimasena, Aswatthaman trembled on the terrace of his car like a tall tree shaken by the tempest. Once more Ghatotkacha, with a broad-headed shaft, quickly cut off the bright bow that was in the hands of Drona's son. The latter, then, taking up another bow capable of bearing of great strain, showered keen arrows (upon his foe) like a cloud pouring torrents of rain. Then the son of Saradwat's daughter, O Bharata, sped many sky-ranging and foe-slaying arrows, winged with gold, towards the sky-ranging Rakshasa. Afflicted with those shafts of Aswatthaman, that vast force of broad-chested Rakshasas looked like a herd of infuriated elephants afflicted by lions. Consuming with his arrows those Rakshasas with their steeds, drivers, and elephants, he blazed forth like the adorable Agni while consuming creatures at the end of the Yuga. Having burnt with his shafts a full Akshauhini of Rakshasa troops, Aswatthaman shone resplendent like the divine Maheswara in heaven after the burning of the triple city. That foremost of victors, Drona's son, having burnt thy foes, shone brilliantly like the blazing Yuga-fire after having burnt all creatures at the end of the Yuga. Then Ghatotkacha, filled with rage, urged that vast Rakshasa force on, saying "Slay the son of Drona!" That command of Ghatotkacha was obeyed by those terrible Rakshasa of bright teeth, large faces, frightful aspects, gaping mouths, long tongues and eyes blazing with wrath. Causing the earth to be filled with their loud leonine roars, and armed with diverse kinds of weapons, they rushed against the son of Drona for slaying him.
Logic - its impressive that Ghatotkaca was able to disarm ashwathama briefly but what makes no sense is that when ashwathama was busy focused on fighting 218,700 rakshasas then ghatotkaca was just twiddling his thumb, which is unrealistic because he's supposed to be fighting with a intention of vengeance in his mind. Why would he fail to take an action or just allow Ashwathama to fight with them freely, why would he not interfere?
ScoreBoard- Though ghatotkaca behaved like a coward (sending others to fight on his behalf, not getting involved etc) he still did not run away so here he was not defeated.

Ghatotkaca uses the famed asani weapon;
{quote}
Indeed, amongst those thousands of kings and those Pandavas, O Bharata, there was none, except that mighty prince of the Rakshasa, the heroic Ghatotkacha, capable of even looking at the son of Drona in that battle, who was thus employed in consuming their ranks with his shafts, resembling snakes of virulent poison. The Rakshasa, O chief of the Bharatas, with eyes rolling in wrath, striking his palms, and biting his (nether) lip, addressed his own driver, saying "Bear me towards the son of Drona." Riding on that formidable car equipped with triumphal banners, that slayer of foes once more proceeded against Drona's son, desirous of a single combat with the latter.
Endued with terrible prowess, the Rakshasa, uttering a loud leonine roar, hurled in that encounter at Drona's son, having whirled it (previously), a terrible Asani of celestial workmanship, and equipped with eight bells. Drona's son, however, jumping down from his car, having left his bow thereon, seized it and hurled it back at Ghatotkacha himself. Ghatotkacha, meanwhile, had quickly alighted from his car. That formidable Asani, of dazzling effulgence, having reduced to ashes the Rakshasa's vehicle with steeds and drivers and standard, entered the earth, having pierced her through. Beholding that feat of Drona's son, his having jumped down and seized that terrible Asani of celestial workmanship, all creatures applauded it.

Yudisther had a weapon similar to Ghatotkaca's
[Quote]
"King Yudhishthira the just, took up a dart whose handle was adorned with gold and gems and whose effulgence was as bright as that of gold. Rolling his eyes that were wide open, he cast his glances on the ruler of the Madras, his heart filled with rage. Thus looked at, O god among men, by that king of cleansed soul and sins all washed away, the ruler of the Madras was not reduced to ashes. This appeared to us to be exceedingly wonderful, O monarch. The illustrious chief of the Kurus then hurled with great force at the king of the Madras that blazing dart of beautiful and fierce handle and effulgent with gems and corals. All the Kauravas beheld that blazing dart emitting sparks of fire as it coursed through the welkin after having been hurled with great force."
"Even like a large meteor falling from the skies at the end of the Yuga. King Yudhishthira the just, in that battle, carefully hurled that dart which resembled kala-ratri (the Death Night) armed with the fatal noose or the foster-mother of fearful aspect of Yama himself, and which like the Brahmana's curse, was incapable of being baffled. Carefully the sons of Pandu had always worshipped that weapon with perfumes and garlands and foremost of seats and the best kinds of viands and drinks. That weapon seemed to blaze like Samvartaka-fire and was as fierce as a rite performed according to the Atharvan of Agnirasa. Created by Tvashtri (the celestial artificer) for the use of Ishana, it was a consumer of the life-breaths and the bodies of all foes."
"It was capable of destroying by its force the Earth and the welkin and all the receptacles of water and creatures of every kind. Adorned with bells and banners and gems and diamonds and decked with stones of lapis lazuli and equipped with a golden handle, Tvashtri himself had forged it with great care after having observed many vows. Unerringly fatal, it was destructive of all haters of Brahma. Having carefully inspired it with many fierce mantras, and endued it with terrible velocity by the exercise of great might and great care, king Yudhishthira hurled it along the best of tracks for the destruction of the ruler of the Madras."

Analysis; Overall its interesting how Ghatotkaca despite being a expert wizard failed to use magic to stop the asani from being tossed backward at him, why did he need to abandon his chariot? Why would a wizard need to avoid contact with a weapon like that? Is their not another way to counter it?

Score Board: Since his chariot was destroyed & he avoided the weapon thrown by his enemy i would say ghatotkaca lost here, so its 2 points for ashwathama & him, so far they've beaten eachother a equal amount of times.
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Ghatotkaca teamed up with Dresthadyumna;
Quote
"Proceeding then, O king, to Dhrishtadyumna's car, Bhimasena's son, taking up a terrible bow that resembled the large bow of Indra himself, once more shot many keen shafts at the illustrious son of Drona. Dhrishtadyumna also fearlessly shot at Aswatthaman's chest many foremost of shafts, equipped with wings of gold and resembling snakes of virulent poison. Then Drona's son shot arrows and long shafts by thousands. These two heroes, however, Ghatotkacha and Dhrishtadyumna, struck and baffled Aswatthaman's shafts by means of their own shafts whose touch resembled that of fire."
"The battle then that took place between those two lions among men (Ghatotkacha on the one side) and the son of Drona (on the other) became fierce in the extreme and gladdened all the combatants, O bull of Bharata's race! Then, accompanied by a thousand cars, three hundred elephants, and six thousand horses, Bhimasena arrived at that spot. The virtuous son of Drona, however, endued as he was with prowess that knew no fatigue, continued to fight with the heroic son of Bhima and with Dhrishtadyumna supported by his followers."
"The prowess then that Drona's son displayed on that occasion was exceedingly wonderful, in as much as, O Bharata, none else amongst all creatures is capable of accomplishing such feats. Within the twinkling of an eye, he destroyed, by means of his sharp shafts, a full Akshauhini of Rakshasa troops with steeds, drivers, cars, and elephants, in the very sight of Bhimasena and Hidimva's son and Prishata's son and the twins and Dharma's son and Vijaya and Achyuta."
Logic - Possibly the mention of yet another aukshouni being slain is fake or its just a reminder (by Sanjaya) to dhritrashtra of ashwathama killing an aukshouni earlier during their battle that night. But the incident mentioned [in the text above the link] is without a doubt a unfair group attack on ashwathama so both bhima & dresthadyumna should feel ashamed of themselves.
Still the guy with the upper hand here was clearly ashwathama but nobody among the main three ran away (Dresthadyumna, Ghatotkaca & Ashwathama) so its not a defeat or win for either side. The score board does not change.
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Ashwathama finally defeated Ghatotkaca:
"That mighty shaft, equipped with beautiful wings, passing through the chest of that Rakshasa, O lord of the earth, entered the earth, piercing through it, Ghatotkacha thereupon fell down on the car. Beholding him fallen down and believing him to be dead, the mighty car-warrior Dhrishtadyumna took him away from the presence of Drona's son and caused him to be placed upon another car. Thus, O king, that car-force of Yudhishthira turned away from the fight. The heroic son of Drona having vanquished his foes, uttered a loud roar."
Logic - to me ashwathama's fight with ghatotkaca (at night 14) shared many similarities to the lengthy bhima vs karna duel (on day 14), where the winner (Bhima) killed many allies of the loser (Karna).
SCORE BOARD now is 3 for Ashwathama 2 for Ghatotkaca.

However this's not the end of their full battle cause they will face eachother again. After he knocked out ghatotkaca then ashwathama overheard the argument going on between Kripa/Karna, this caused him to get involved in drama/discussion. But Ghatotkaca was busy recovering while Ashwathama would advance further, he defeated Dresthadyumna & murders multiple unnamed warriors. The kaurav army also regrouped eventually lighting lamps near their chariot's to make the battlefield & opposing armies more visible to eachother.
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Ashwathama end's up fighting Drupada instead;
"Drona's son covered the, ruler of the Panchalas, and Drona himself covered the Srinjaya, with showers of straight shafts in that battle."
Opponents switch now;
"Aswatthaman, O monarch, resisted Bhimasena's son, Rakshasa (Ghatotkacha) acquainted with a hundred kinds of illusion, as the latter advanced. Vrishasena. in that battle resisted the mighty Drupada with his troops and followers as the latter advanced for getting at Drona."

It has not been explained how or why it happened [the choice of who fight's who] but at least ghatotkaca has recovered now so the saga of his battles with ashwathama can end.
SCOREBOARD maintained 2 to 3.
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FINAL battle.
Quote;
"Ghatotkacha sped at his foe shafts of the measure of the Aksha of a car, and covered that bull among car-warriors therewith, like clouds pouring torrents of rain. With his own shafts resembling snakes of virulent poison, Drona's son, however, in that battle, quickly dispelled that arrowy shower before it could reach him. He then pierced that chastiser of foes, Ghatotkacha, that prince of the Rakshasas, with hundreds of keen and swift-coursing arrows, all capable of penetrating into the very vitals. Thus pierced with those shafts by Aswatthaman, that Rakshasas, on the field of battle, looked beautiful, O monarch, like a porcupine with quills erect on its body."
"Then the valiant son of Bhimasena, filled with rage, mangled the son of Drona with many fierce arrows, whizzing through the air with the roar of thunder. And he rained on Aswatthaman a perfect shower of arrows of diverse kinds; some, equipped with heads like razors; some, shaped as the crescent; some, only pointed; some, frog-faced; some, with heads resembling the boar's ear; some, barbed; and some of other species. Like the wind dispersing mighty masses of clouds, Drona's son, O king, without his senses being agitated, destroyed with his own terrible arrows, inspired by mantras with the force of celestial weapons, that fierce, unbearable and unrivalled shower of weapons, whose sound resembled the roar of thunder, and which fell incessantly upon him."
"It seemed then that another encounter was taking place in the welkin between weapons (as the combatants), which was terrible, and which, O king, filled the warriors with awe. With the sparks all around, generated by the clash of the weapons, shot by those two warriors, the welkin looked beautiful as illumined by myriads of fire-flies in the evening. Drona's son then, filling all the points of the compass with his shafts, shrouded the Rakshasa himself, for doing what was agreeable to thy sons. Then commenced a battle once more between Drona's son and the Rakshasa on that night of thick darkness, which resembled the encounter between Sakra and Prahlada."
"Then Ghatotkacha, filled with rage, struck Drona's son, in that battle, on the chest with ten shafts, each resembling the Yuga-fire, Deeply pierced the Rakshasa, the mighty son of Drona began to tremble in that battle like a tall tree shaken by the wind. Supporting himself by holding the flagstaff, he swooned away. Then all thy troops, O king, uttered cries of Oh and Alas. Indeed, O monarch, all thy warriors then regarded Drona's son as slain. Beholding Aswatthaman in that plight, the Panchalas and the Srinjayas in that battle uttered leonine roars. Then that crusher of foes, the mighty car-warrior Aswatthaman, recovering his senses, forcibly drawing the bow with his left hand, stretching the bowstring to his ear, quickly shot a terrible shaft resembling the rod of Yama himself, aiming at Ghatotkacha. That excellent shafts, fierce and equipped with golden wings, piercing through the chest of the Rakshasa, entered the earth, O king."
"Deeply pierced, O monarch, by Drona's son who was proud of his prowess in battle, that prince of Rakshasas, endued with great strength, sat down on the terrace of his car. Beholding Hidimva's son deprived of his senses, his charioteer, inspired with fear, speedily removed him from the field, bearing him away from the presence of Drona's son. Having pierced that prince of Rakshasas, Ghatotkacha, in that encounter thus, Drona's son, that mighty car-warrior, uttered a loud roar. Worshipped by thy sons as also by all thy warriors, O Bharata, Aswatthaman's body blazed up like the midday sun."
Logic - Ashwathama was knocked out first but later so was Ghatotkaca, he basically returned the favor to him. Overall both warrior's performed equally in this fight so no point lost or gained.

After that incident Ashwathama ends up gaining a anti feat which is a bad performance against Dresthadyumna due to losing to him despite having a group attack advantage. But little to no action is done by Ghatotkaca until Jatasura's son made his entrance.
CONCLUSION - the better fighter was indeed Ashwathama but it was not a giant mismatch.
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Wednesday, December 25, 2024

The biggest lie 'in the end dharma wins' or "dharma is with the winner"

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Examples of evil winning in life will be provided by me in this post. For those that unaware/ignorant the term KKK stands for ku klux klan. I desire to talk of indians & criminals that are not indian too cause they will prove my claim that dharma is not always with the winner.

Non Indian's:
The KKK - they hid behind masks to conceal their identities & committed countless murders, castrations & rapes. They terrorized innocent people, yet still their group was never held accountable at all, they never faced justice, repercussion or counter attacks at all. They got away with crimes. The obvious immediate question i as a indian need to ask [was dharma with the ku klux klan] since they basically won despite being a gang of evil individuals?

Villisca Axe Murderer - killed eight human beings, mostly underaged minors, he was never brought to justice, despite the fact that his victims were Caucasian/white.
Ted Bundy - he was not affected negatively by karma because he was able to kill over thirty women yet he himself only died once, even if his death sentence is considered justice then still you can argue that he got a better fate compared to his victims. Think about it, he was able to live over a decade in prison with the knowledge that he was a social celebrity & his case was famous, he received countless envelopes that were love letter's from women.
Where's the fanbases & cults for his victims? How many of the names of his victim's are even known? This mr bundy fellow was not only a criminal he was also a child molester, yet still for some reason he lived a better life compared to any of his victims & gained international fame. That is not fair by any means. Here karmic justice did not exist at all, if karma did exist then it seems to be biased in favor of evil people, aggressors & perpetrators.
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PIN [pure indian national]:
Dawood Ibrahim (yes he qualifies as a indian citizen like it or not), he was born in india so no matter where he lives in i will refer to him as a Indian not a pakistani or anything else.
Even if the day comes where dawood is arrested at the end of the era he has lived a luxurious decent life, has the status of a global elite, has learned, experienced & achieved things that his victims never did & most human beings alive will not be able to do either. So dawood has clearly gained victory in life despite being a gangster, criminal, mafia boss, druglord & killer. Because he has not experienced pain or karmic justice. He has not been given any penalty for his crime, so where is the justice for his victims? Or is DHARMA with dawood then?

For dawood's haters more bad news exists because a individual named "Balasaheb Thackeray" is also pro dawood, he considers him to be his comrade-in-arm's. He defended his property from being destroyed.
Evidence;
Logic - This shows even hindus themselves have allied with dawood despite his heinous crimes, even though people he drugged, robbed/killed were innocent hindus.
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Gabbar Singh Gujjar - he became famous when a movie character was named after him & based off of him played by amjad khan, imagine how the ghosts/relatives of his victims felt after that?

Crimes done by the real Gabbar;
"He committed a series of murders and dacoities in the Indian state of Madhya Pradesh and Uttar Pradesh. In December 1957, he went on to disfigure several persons in Machhuari, Bhakre, Chammodi and Chirenasta villages."
[ending]
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Tipu Sultan was a ancient medieval era monarch who controlled a region which was influential in rocket based technology, he fought against the european invaders who tried invading south india, but he was also a corrupt man that murdered innocent individuals, particularly hindus.

Tipu Sultan was rewarded by history nearly two centuries after his death, a serial was created about him & named after him, even though many innocent humans died in a fire related accident while filming the tv series still the indian government allowed sanjay khan to keep filming his serial about Tipu. Is that fair to the victims that died while working on stage? Is it fair to the thousands of innocent hindu citizens that got killed by Tipu?

Even in the animal kingdom their were vicious creatures that gained fame like the Champawat tiger, but no one remembers the names of all 436 humans that this tiger killed?
Was dharma with tipu or this champawat tiger?

In the Battle of Talikota was dharma on the side of anti-hindus? Cause the winners were Muslim not hindu.
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MB characters:
TKP (the kalinga princess) who was abducted by Suyodhan. Yeah suyodhan lived a bad & embarrassing life he was punished true, but the point is that its not like the kalinga princess ever experienced any happiness, joy, comfort or contentment in her life. She was locked behind closed door's, never went out in public, after her husband & son were killed in kurukshetra then she had nothing to do besides maybe just eat food, she lived in the territory of the pandavas until she committed suicide in the Asramavasika Parva of Mahabharat. And her name is neither known or mentioned cause she was deemed a irrelevant person in the story of this book. So though duryodhan was indeed punished did his victim (the lady who was his wife) ever get any compensation for what she had to go through?

What about ghatotkaca? he can be considered a victim because his life was tributed to null the shakti astra, but in exchange he got nothing, he is portrayed by tv serials as a one day warrior who did not contribute to anything in kurukshetra prior to night fourteen. According to the authentic Mahabharat book of drona parva he was insulted & disrespected by even Shri Krishna despite being a pandav warrior, so their was no mourning or sulking for his death. Ghatotkaca did not receive a honorable funeral its like Bhima did not care for him either.
Their was no mention of what happened to his mother hidimva after his death either. Its like he did not matter, and the whole fake scenes of bhima going on rampages after ghatotkaca died in kurukshetra, those only happen in fake tv serial's like SPK & StarPlus's fake bharat. If you read kmg & bori ce then you will find that Bhima did not commit any deed apart from holding back a few kaurava chariot warriors after ghatotkaca's death. Their was not a single kaurava that died after ghatotkaca vadha & before drona vadha, so bhima did not kill warriors after ghatotkaca died.
Did droupadi (even in tv serials) shed a single tear drop for Vikarna? He defended her after all, i already know that mahabharat (the canonical book) does not mention her crying at all, but my question is for fake tv serials where she is portrayed by rupa ganguly, pooja sharma, pankuri awasthy etc. In tv serials she is portrayed as a more positive, noble woman, she is given more scenes & her life is explored. But even in these tv shows their is no incident of her shedding tears for vikarna or showing sympathy to him for his death.

Final statement;
I myself do not believe in the yuga theory (that at the moment we are living in a kali evil phase) but its quite clear that even if its true then in dwapara yuga still negative characters or people did not receive punishment or get affected by KARMA.
Common sense and realism will tell you that the concept of "dharma is with those that are the winners" is inherently flawed & incorrect. Because imagine a scenario where a incestuous couple had offspring then who really gets punished? Its the innocent poor child that was born with deformities due to the mistake of their parents, thats valid proof that karma does not exist.
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Tuesday, December 24, 2024

Proving canonicity/authenticity of Parshuram vs Bhishma

Reasons behind creating this post are;
1 - back in the year of 2018 or possibly 2019 a vishnu bhakt/vaisnavite (named "nayonika vats") and the translator's/editors of bori critical edition tried to make false claims of the parshurama-bhishma fight being a interpolation.
2 - My purpose will be to prove that this battle actually did happen since theirs no point in proving that bhishma won fairly cause i already proved that a long time ago in 2022. But i do not by any means consider bhishma to be a great fighter/warrior based on his victory over parshurama, cause for me parshuram is not among the top 10 warriors of MB or Ramayana.

3 - Their have been multiple tv serials about mahabharat, but only a couple have actually tried to portray the fight between parshurama/bhishma. One was chopra's MB (1988) the other was the serial of Sanjay Khan and of course the third is starplus's MB show. Ironically it was the muslim sanjay khan who showed his parshuram (anil yadav) dominating bhishma, their parshurama used an axe and bhishma used a double edged blade/sword, while in starplus (the lesser said the better besides the fact their presentation was the worst). But point is that sanjay khan showed parshuram disarming bhishma then giving him his weapon back so bhishma could continue the fight (basically sparing bhishma's life) yet sanjay khan isn't even a hindu let alone a vishnu bhakt.
The only presentation here which was close to accurate was the one done by CHOPRA cause he showed the battle as it was written which was a ARROW FIGHT. Unfortunately he failed to show parshuram getting knocked out by arrows of bhishma. Overall what im trying to get through to readers is that no tv serial showed parshuram losing even chopra's showed it as a stalemate mostly.

4 - Tv serial's in India have always done their best to guard the reputation of warriors & characters that are vishnu avtaars, even to the limit of insulting Shiva himself. Like in the "DevonKeDevMahadev" serial the directors did not want to show Jalandhar defeating Vishnu so they decided to never show a jalandhar vs vishnu fight, instead they show parshuram insulting & threatening jalandhar to harm his reputation more.
They also dont show that when lord Shiva disguised himself as a yaksha then he wielded a twig which even vishnu failed to move or lift, but these same tv serials will show ravan failing in the fake swayamvara of Seetha. All because of cognitive bias that society has.
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POST BEGINS.
Cross references for his fight against bhishma:
Anusasana Parva.
"He could not be vanquished by even Rama of Jamadagni's race with his celestial weapons of great energy."
Drona Parva;
"Who is there that is competent to vanquish him who could not be vanquished by thee before, although thou, endued with great energy, hadst vanquished Rama himself in battle, that fierce destroyer of the Kshatriya race, worshipped, besides, by the gods and the Danavas?"
Logic - though this quote is a cross reference for the fight another possibility that is implied by this quote is that the reason parshuram did not take action against danavas is probably due to the fact that they worshiped him. I assume these danavas feared the kshatriyas so thats why they worshiped the man who terrorized kshatriyas (parshuram).

Bhishma Parva.
[quote]
"Jamadagni's son Rama, who was acquainted with every weapon and whom none excelled, when addrest for battle on behalf of Amvya, was vanquished by Bhishma in combat. Thou tellest me that that Bhishma, who was the foremost of all warriors and who resembled Indra himself in the feats he achieved, hath been slain. What can be a greater grief to me than this? Endued with great intelligence, he that was not slain even by that slayer of hostile heroes, that Rama, the son of Jamadagni, who defeated in battle crowds of Kshatriyas repeatedly, he hath now been slain by Sikhandin."
Conclusion - i provided enough quotes directly from Mahabharat which show that the fight happened outside of udyoga parva.

So from now on their should never be a ignorant claim like "the fight is an interpolation" or "this battle was believed by many scholars to be a later addition" just cause Vaishnavites don't want to accept or admit a time where parshurama was defeated fairly.
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Friday, November 22, 2024

The truth about Parshuram (2nd chapter)

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Introduction; My desire to at least debunk 3 fake myths that are based around the overrated character of parshurama. First i will prove he did not win against Sahastrarjun through merit, second goal is to prove that parshuram had a limited life-span (he was no chiranjeevi/immortal).
3rd objective will be too prove that parshuram losing his powers (after a fight with raam) is a fake claim made by obsessed bhakts of his that dismiss real facts.

After that i will compare Parshurama with other Maha-Bharat warriors. But not with pandav arjuna cause that deserves a separate post.
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SAHASTRARJUN VS PARSHURAMA.
According to Puranas;
"Thereafter, for slaying Bhārgava in the battle the king took up the trident that had been given to him by Datta and that had never been futile. He took it up with due chanting of mantras. That trident had the lustre of a hundred suns. It could not be checked by Suras or Asuras. Aiming it at Rāma, he hurled it with his entire strength. The trident fell on the head of Bhārgava, O lord of the Earth. Due to the impact that he was hit by the trident, Bhārgava became pained. He became unconscious, O prominent king, remembering Hari. When Bhārgava fell there, all the Devas became agitated due to fear. Keeping Brahmā, Viṣṇu and Maheśvara in front they all came there. Lord Śaṅkara who has great knowledge and who is the conqueror of Death, himself resuscitated Bhārgava by means of the Sañjīvanī Vidyā. Regaining his consciousness, Rāma saw the Suras in front of him. O leading king, he bowed down to Brahmā and other suras with devotion." [end]
Logic - so parshuram was miserably defeated by mard sahastrarjun, he got resurrected by sanjeevani vidya. It's unfair.

According to archeologists:
[Image]
Logic; Parshuram fought Sahastrarjun only when he was past physical prime or peak as a warrior. So he waited for years till after he would become an aged person. That must be what it was meant in MB's vana parva when its mentioned Vishnu spent years doing tapasya, he was actually waiting for sahastrarjun to get older.

Quote: "And on that occasion, all that was for the good of the world of beings, was communicated by the lord of gods; and the blessed god worshipped by the world, to do all that was necessary, went to the delightful Vadari wood which was his own chosen retreat for practising penances."
[end]
Logic - here a tridev himself needed to do tapasya. Because that tridev (vishnu)'s base level power was not adequate to kill sahastrarjun, their is no way parshuram could fairly beat a character that vishnu himself needed to train to surpass, cause vishnu is tougher than his own avatars.
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According to indonesian ramayana (text not corrupted by india’s british masters) parshurama killed him after sahastrarjun heard a rumor that his beloved wife died so sahastrarjun let down his guard (he lost a desire to live a good life).
Logic - This source might be dismissed by other fans & hindus, but people should realize that kmg mahabharat (which is more authentic than BORI CE) was written or translated in 1896, while Indonesian stories were written before any british raaj era. So the fact this source is older means it deserves to be acknowledged in a debate/discussion.
Parshuram had no real victory outside of his incident against Sahastrarjun so it makes more sense to say that Parshuram cheated or his victory was a fluke.
So Parshuram did not defeat Sahastrarjun he just ended the life of a man who wanted to die (he had no interest being alive anymore). It is not impressive in anyway or something which can be used for gauging his ability as a warrior.
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According to Mahabharat quotes Sahastrarjun lost against Parshuram cause of a curse only.
[Begin]
Apava, O mighty-armed king, seeing his retreat consumed by the powerful Kshatriya, cursed that monarch in wrath, saying "Since, O Arjuna, without excepting these my specious woods, thou hast burnt them, therefore, Rama (of Bhrigu's race) will lop off thy (thousand) arm." The mighty Arjuna, however, of great prowess, always devoted to peace, ever regardful of Brahmanas and disposed to grant protection (unto all class), and charitable and brave, O Bharata, did not think of that curse denounced on him by that high-souled Rishis. His powerful sons, always haughty and cruel, in consequence of that course, became the indirect cause of his death.
Logic - the power of this curse would change the fate of a upcoming battle so even when sahastrarjun made parshuram faint or killed parshuram (with a trishula) then still parshuram needs to come back to life so the curse of Apava can become true. Parshuram won due to unfair advantages. He is not selfmade instead parshuram was a guy that achieved status due to nepotism factors.
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Their exist many hints of Sahastrarjun's superiority over Parshuram in both epics of Ramayana/MB.
Parshuram admits indraputra Arjuna is better than himself;
"This child of thine, O Kunti, will be equal unto Kartavirya in energy and Siva in prowess. Invincible like Sakra himself he will spread thy fame far and wide."
https://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m01/m01124.htm
Logic - if a warrior whose hailed as a equal of kartavirya is considered better than parshuram its fair to say kartavirya himself was superior too.

Drona's speech; "Arjuna is even greater than what Jamadagni's son hath described him to be."
The point here is not comparing parshuram to pandav arjun but rather the objective is to prove if pandav arjun was born to be a equal of sahastrarjun & the same pandav arjun was better than bhishma (who fairly defeated parshuram) its fair to say that sahastrarjun was superior to parshurama too then.
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2ND MYTH TO BE DISPROVED BY ME:
Addressing the fake-concept of him being a immortal/Chiranjeevi. I will debunk this garbage/rubbish claim that his devotees have made immediately.

Here is a quote from the 13th night of Kurukshetra where the pandavas get informed by Narada Muni that Parshuram's death is also scheduled, basically his lifespan is limited too.
Quote; "Even the great ascetic Rama, the hero worshipped by all heroes, that son of Jamadagni, of great fame, will die, without being contented (with the period of his life). Rooting out all evils from the earth, he caused the primeval Yuga to set in."
[Ending]

2nd quote;
"By making gifts of Gold, Rama became cleansed of all his sins, and finally attained to a high place in heaven that is unattainable by other men."
Logic - He is already dead spending time in swarga lok under Indra Dev. So he wont be a teacher for any future avatar like Kalki.

So now hopefully at least 10 percent of the hindu population will accept parshuram is not immortal.
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3rd DEBUNK.
A common argument his devotees made "parshuram lost his connection to vishnu during the fight with ram" as an excuse for his beating at the hand's of Bhishma in Mahabharat people try to say he wasn't at his peak or prime as a warrior.

I will now provide genuine quotes which prove my case that Parshuram actually gained back all power he lost.
[Quote]
"And behold there, O Yudhisthira, the tirtha of Bhrigu that is celebrated over the three worlds and adored, O king, by great Rishis. Bathing here, Rama (of Bhrigu's race) regained his might, which had been taken away from him (by Dasaratha's son). Bathing here, O son of Pandu, with thy brothers and Krishna, thou wilt certainly regain that energy of thine that hath been taken away by Duryodhana, even as Rama regained his that had been taken away by Dasaratha's son in hostile encounter."
[End]
2nd quote;
"And after the expiration of a year, the Pitris, beholding Rama dwelling there deprived of energy, his pride quelled, and himself sunk in affliction."
3rd Quote;
"Bathing in all the tirthas of that stream, thou wilt regain thy energy! There Parshuram, in that river is the tirthas where your ancestor Bhrigu, in the celestial age had practised ascetic penances of great merit."
"Thus addressed by them, Rama, O son of Kunti, did what the Pitris bade him, and obtained back at this tirtha, O son of Pandu, the energy he had lost."
Note: this's crystal clear proof that Parshuram after losing to Ram had gained back any energy and power he had lost in that fight. So the excuse of him not being at full power/potential during his beating at hand's of Gangaya, will not work here.

Possible theory - maybe Parshuram had to wait until Raam passes away/dies to get back his power. It was a very rare case in treta yuga cause Vishnu had to divide his soul into 2 bodies (apart from his own), so raam/parshuram would each have 1/3rd of his power.
If u do math then parshuram gives 32 percent to raam leaving 1 % for himself (to stay alive) then he just waits until raam's death so the soul could return to him since raam's body will cease to exist. It could make sense if raam's soul separated from his body before the battle of parshuram vs bhishma so parshuram was already at full power during the time of this duel.
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COMPARING parshuram to the mahabharat warrior's i mentioned i would compare him too.
Bheem vs Bhishma;
"Bhima alone, approaching Bhishma, encountered him in battle. Then in that encounter between Bhima and Bhishma, a fierce and terrible uproar arose among all the troops (of the Kauravas). The Pandavas then, filled with joy, uttered leonine shouts. During that destructive carnage, king Duryodhana, surrounded by his uterine brothers, protected Bhishma in that battle. Then that foremost of car-warriors, Bhima, slew Bhishma's charioteer. Thereupon the steeds no longer controlled, ran away from the field with car."
Logic: do not make up excuses for him, the coward bhishma had multiple kourav brother's & princes to aid him, they could have protected his driver but failed. Bhishma if not beaten was still forced to retreat, so it counts against him. Vrikodara Bheem fired an arrow so quickly that Bhishma could not deflect it in time or prevent it from reaching his driver.
Suyodhana vs Bheem.
{quotE}
"Aiming a terrible shaft blazing as Death's rod, the Kuru king, excited with rage struck Bhimasena between his two breasts. Deeply pierced therewith, and greatly pained, he sat down on the terrace of his car. And while seated on the terrace of his car, he swooned away. Beholding Bhima thus unmanned, the illustrious and mighty car-warriors of the Pandava army, headed by Abhimanyu could not bear it."
Logic - it's confirmed that suyodhana was superior to not only parshuram but even bhishma too.

Suyodhana (when he has divine armor) vs Panchal prince's;
"Yudhamanyu, excited with wrath, quickly sped, in that battle, thirty shafts at the centre of thy son's chest. Then Uttamaujas also, excited with wrath, pierced Duryodhana's charioteer with shafts decked with gold, and despatched him to Yama's abode. Duryodhana also, O monarch, then slew the four steeds as also the two Parshni charioteers of Uttamaujas, the prince of Panchalas. Then Uttamaujas, in that battle, becoming steedless and driverless, quickly ascended the car of his brother, Yudhamanyu. Ascending on the car of his brother, he struck Duryodhana's steeds with many shafts. Slain therewith, those steeds fell down on the earth."
"Upon the fall of his steeds, the valiant Yudhamanyu then, by a mighty weapon, quickly cut off Duryodhana's bow and then (with another shaft), his leathern fence. That bull among men then, thy son, jumping down from that steedless and driverless car, took up a mace and proceeded against the two princes of Panchala. Beholding that subjugator of hostile town, thus advancing in wrath, both Yudhamanyu and Uttamaujas jumped down from the terrace of their car."
"Then Duryodhana armed as he was with a mace, pressed down into the earth with that mace that foremost of cars furnished with gold, with steeds and driver and standard. Thy son then, that scorcher of foes, having thus crushed that car, steedless and driverless as he himself was, quickly ascended the car of the king of the Madras."
Yes duryodhana was able to destroy the chariot of his enemy by using a mace but duryodhana failed to use his arrow skill to cut or deflect the arrows of yudhamanyu that disarmed him. So its evident of duryodhan's inferiority compared to yudhamanyu as an archer. But this same duryodhana was able to cut the bow of bheem six times & hit him so fatally with arrows that he fainted. While Bheem was able to fire arrows with such quick speed that Bhishma failed to deflect them & they would result in a embarrassing retreat for bhishma.

Yudhamanyu lost to kripa:
"Yudhamanyu, piercing Kripa, quickly cut off his bow. Then Kripa, that foremost of all wielders of weapons, taking up another bow, felled Yudhamanyu's standard and driver and umbrella on the Earth. At this, the mighty car-warrior Yudhamanyu retreated on his car, driving it himself."

Conclusion - So at last even kripa was superior to Parshuram & Bhishma. If the battle does not involve arrows but is focused mainly on astras only then should kripa, bheem, duryodhan, yudhamanyu and uttamoujas be labelled superior to parshurama/bhishma.
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