Putting an end to the Hanumana topic (4).

Intro - nothings gonna stop me from exposing hanutati again!

This time it will be strictly about Ramayana characters only.

Part A - which vanars are better warriors than Hanuman barring "Vali" as he has already been discussed in prior content. And the vanars i will be mentioning are all inferior to Vali but still better than hanutati.

https://logicastra.blogspot.com/2021/06/valis-achievements.html (this's a link to a previous post concerning the character of Mahabali Vali).

Part B - solely non vanara characters.

Also Hanuman was not "immortal" or "eternally youthful" he does not live forever, his lifespan is just as limited as ours, and as a dog's lifespan would be limited.

The verse of Kishkinda Kanda clearly states that:

"Oh, ablest Hanuma, the Thousand-eyed Indra kind-heartedly gave you a choicest boon saying that your death occurs only by your own volition." [4-66-28, 29a]

http://www.valmikiramayan.net/kishkindha/sarga66/kishkindha_66_frame.htm

So his death will occur eventually, he is no immortal.

------------------------------

Many vanars existed who were superior or stronger than 'hanutati' ever could be.

SUGREEV

[1st] Freed himself from Kumbhkarn's grip.

[2nd] Defeated prince Kumbha (son of Kumbhakarna).

"The valiant Sugreeva forcefully descended his fist, which shone like the solar disc encircled by a thousand rays, on the breast of Kumbha." "That Kumbha, very much hurt by that blow, was exhausted and then fell down, like fire whose flame has extinguished." "When Kumbha was killed in battle by Sugreeva the chief of monkeys, possessing a terrific prowess, the earth with its mountains and forests trembled."

http://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/yuddha/sarga76/yuddha_76_frame.htm

[3rd] Kumbha defeated Angada.

"That Angada was very much perturbed and fell down, swooning. Seeing the unconquerable Angada fallen down and sinking into depression."

"Hearing of Angada being seized with anguish in that great combat, Rama sent out for help, leaders of monkeys, headed by Jambavan."

http://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/yuddha/sarga76/yuddha_76_frame.htm

[4th] Sugreev defeated the vanars that were sent to murder him:

"He that very evil minded one tried many times to annihilate me, and Raghava, I killed those combatants monkeys that are deployed by Vali to kill me."

http://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/kish/sarga8/kishkindha_8_frame.htm

Logic - Vali is his brother and knows all about Sugreevs strength, power and ability. So he would not send some canon fodder or average warriors, he would send some very powerful men that are the best among vanaras after sugreev.

[5th] Sugreev's power against Vali.

"Sugreeva unhesitatingly uprooted a saala tree with his force and thrashed the limbs of Vali as with the thunderbolt thrashing a great mountain." [4-16-23]

"Those two, Vali and Sugreeva, with their sensational energy, triumphing zeal, frightful physiques, swiftness as good as the Divine Eagle Garuda, vigilance in exploring perilous body parts of one another, ravagement of their own enemies fought frighteningly, like the sun and moon in the sky, which is inconceivable." [4-16-25, 26a]

But Vali being the possessor of might and vigour progressed and though greatly mighty is son of sun, Sugreeva, regressed. [4-16-26b, 27a]

"Among those two there happened a deadly fight time and again using trees with branches, peaks of mountains, their own nails that are similar to the razor-sharp edges of thunderbolts, and with fists, knees, feet, and arms,"

http://valmikiramayan.pcriot.com/utf8/kish/sarga16/kishkindha_16_frame.htm

Analysis: this above passage is filled of seperate selective quote's from the final fight with Vali, only meant to show Sugreev's pros instead of the con's, as Sugreev's power is often ignored, it is true he lost but it is also true that he performed well and brutally hurt Vali before his defeat.

Compared to hanutati.

Hanuman just runs away like a scared b!tch from mighty Kumbhkarna.

Vanaras that fled from Kumbhkarna:

"Thereafter, with the coaxing words and inferential arguments by Angada, all those fleeing commanders of monkeys turned back."

Hanuman being in the same group:"Dvipada, Panasa and hanuma marched ahead very quickly, with their faces turned towards the battle."

http://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/yuddha/sarga66/yuddha_66_frame.htm

the guy that scared hanutati and kesari

------

ANOTHER VANAR

Samnadha:

"Whose huge form no other four-begged animal is having, by which intelligent monkey, battle was given earlier to Indra the Lord of celestials on a field of battle but no defeat was sustained by him. He is a commander of commanders and the grand-father of monkeys, famous as Samnadana by name."

"This Samnada, whose striding prowess is equal to that of Indra the Lord of Celestials was born of a youthful Gandharva maiden and krishnavartman for the purpose of helping the celestials in a combat between celestials and demoneous."

Chapter: http://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/yuddha/sarga27/yuddha_27_frame.htm

Logic - the same Indra was much more powerful than that lallu or pajeet or hijda, or chutiya or bhagoda known as "Hanuman"

Hanuman's other defeat.

Quote:

"I heard an exceedingly roaring and hallooing sound, mixed with sounds of girdles and anklets in the abode of Ravana."
"Then, I was very much frightened and contracted my physique. I, on my part, remained hidden like a bird in that Simsupa tree dense with foliage."

http://valmikiramayan.pcriot.com/utf8/sundara/sarga58/sundarasans58.htm

This line happen's right after that: "Then, the mighty Ravana and his wives reached that place where Seetha was staying."

Conclusion; thus hanuman ran away like a coward once he saw brave and mighty Ravan with his wives coming to the place hanutati was at.

-----

Angada (son of mighty Vali).

First reason;

Why a hundred, if need be you are capable to go up to a hundred thousand yojana-s and come back... but this method of our sending you is uncanonical... [4-65-21]

Comment/Logic; This is a bigger achievement than hanutatis, cause hanutati's feat is only crossing one hundred not one lac (100,000).

http://valmikiramayan.pcriot.com/utf8/kish/sarga65/kishkindha_65_frame.htm

OTHER REASON.

Angad foils the attempt lankan warriors made to capture him;

Hearing Ravana's words, four terrible demons seized Angada who, in his splendour, resembled a blazing torch. Then, the prudent and heroic Angada the son of Tara voluntarily allowed himself to be seized, in order to display his prowess before the host of demons. Then, seizing like unto birds those attendants clung to his arms, Angada leapt on to the palace that resembled like a mountain. All those four demons were shaken out by Angada's impetuous leap and fell on the ground there under the eyes of their king."

"Thereafter, the glorious Angada the son of Vali ascended the roof of Ravana's palace, which equaled the summit of a mountain in height. That roof of the palace, trampled by Angada, crumbled - as a peak of Himalayan range was shattered long ago by lightening - before Ravana's gaze. After destroying the roof of the palace, Angada proclaimed his name and with a triumphant roar, rose into the air."

"Causing restlessness to all the demons but delight to the monkeys, Angada approached close to Rama, who was stationed in the middle of the monkey-forces.Because of the destruction of his palace, Ravana on his part got extremely angry. Foreseeing his own destruction, he became a desponded demon."

http://valmikiramayan.pcriot.com/utf8/yuddha/sarga41/yuddha_41_frame.htm

Commentary; he even destroyed the roof of the lankan throneroom/court. It has nothing to do with his foot, but this achievement far surpassed whatever Hanumana did.

And as per Jambavan this Angad character could cross more than 100,000 yojanas while hanutati could only cross 100 at most, thats less than one percent of Angad's endurance, capability, stamina, swiftness & speed.

Hanuman also was never a match or challenge for Meghanad, so if Angad could fight better against Meghanad then Angad is superior to Hanuman as well.

-----

Neela - fought better against Ravan, Nikumbh etc than hanuman did, so he can be ranked above, hanutati only did better on one occasion that was his fight with kumbhkarn.

I can prove it very easily.

1ST PART

Performance of behenchod Hanuman:

"Thus spoken, the highly energetic and the valiant Ravana the Lord of Demons struck with a violent blow on hanumas chest with the palm of his hand. Hanuma, thus struck with Ravana's palm, reeled repeatedly."

http://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/yuddha/sarga59/yuddha_59_frame.htm

"The powerful Ravana, enraged, his eyes red with fury and whirling his fist with force knocked it down violently on Hanuma's chest. Under the shock, Hanuma reeled once again. Seeing that mighty Hanuma exhausted, Ravana turned his chariot towards Nila."

http://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/yuddha/sarga59/yuddha_59_frame.htm

2ND PART

Performance of Shree Nila:

"With his terrific arrows in the likeness of serpents, Ravana the powerful Lord of Demons pierced the vital parts of his enemy, thus overwhelming Nila the Monkey-general. Nila, the Army General of Monkeys, tormented by that hail of arrows, with one hand hurled a great rock at Ravana the king of demons. Then, the mighty Ravana, however, shattered the rock hurled by Nila with seven pointed arrows and it fell down, crumbling to pieces."

"Seeing that rock crumbling to pieces, Nila the Army-general the destroyer of enemies who resembled the Fire of Time, glowed with fury. In that fight, Nila hurled Aswakarna trees, Shala trees with extensive flowering, Chuta trees and other various types of trees. Ravana, confronting those trees, bursted them and showered a hail of dangerous darts on Nila the son of Fire-God."

"Showered by a multitude of shafts, as from a cloud, the mighty Nila assumed a diminutive form and leapt on to the point of Ravana's standard. Seeing Nila the son of Fire-God standing well on the point of his standard, Ravana inflamed with fury. Then, Nila shouted loudly. Beholding that monkey sometimes leaping on to the point of Ravana's standard sometimes on to the tip of his bow and sometimes on to the peak of his diadem, Lakshmana, Hanuma and Rama were astonished."

"The mighty Ravana, amazed at the monkey's agility, seized a marvellous and glowing arrow called Agneya the weapon of Fire. Thereafter, those monkeys who felt rejoiced to see Ravana disconcerted at the agility of Nila and had found an occasion for jubilation, shouted joyously."

Then, provoked by the shouts of the monkeys, his heart possessed with confusing, Ravana did not know what to do. Ravana the demon, taking up an arrow, charged with the missile presided over by the fire-God, aimed at Nila who had perched on the tip of his standard.

[CONTINUES]

Then, Ravana the king of demons said,: "O monkey! You are endowed with agility combined with a supreme power of magic." "Do you save your life if you can, eventhogh you are creating numerous deeds of various kinds indeed worthy of your own self, O, monkey!" "Even then, the arrow charged with a mystic missile I am about to loose, will severe you from life, which existence you seek to preserve." Thus speaking, Ravana the long-armed King of Demons, having placed Agni Missile with his arrow, struck Nila the Army-General.

Struck on the chest by the arrow combined with a missile, Nila being burnt all over, suddenly fell to the ground. Yet by virtue of the powerful aid of his father and his own native vigour, though brought to his knees on to the earth, he was not deprived of his life. Seeing Nila unconscious, Ravana, eager for fight, in his chariot whose rattling sounded like thunder-clouds, rushed on Lakshmana.

http://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/yuddha/sarga59/yuddha_59_frame.htm

3RD PART

Comparison of how they encountered prince Nikumbha.

Performance of Shree Nila:

Nila too of great energy fought with Nikumbha. Nikumbha chopped Nila, having a radiance of a mass of collyrium in battle, by his sharp arrows, like a cloud by the rays of the sun. Then, Nikumbha the swift-handed demon again wounded Nila by a hundred arrows in the battle and laughed continuously. Nila chopped the head of the charioteer of Nikumbha by the wheel of the same chariot in that fight.

http://valmikiramayan.pcriot.com/utf8/yuddha/sarga43/yuddha_43_frame.htm

Performance of behenchod Hanuman:

The demons and the monkeys too, out of fear, were unable even to make the slightest movement. The mighty Hanuma, on his part, stood alone among them, with his breast bared to the fury of the attack, in front of Nikumbha. The strong Nikumbha, with his arms as strong as his club, hurled his club having sun-like splendour, on the breast of that mighty Hanuma. The titanic club, which fell on the wide and rock-like chest of Hanuma, at once shattered into hundreds of fragments, like hundreds of meteors shattering into the sky.

Thus struck by him, the mighty Hanuma the monkey-chief clenched his fist forcibly. The greatly splendoured, powerful and swift Hanuma, with the violence of the wind-god, his father, lifting that fist, struck it against, Nikumbha's breast with force. By the blow of that fist there, his armour got split up and red blood profusely oozed out, as a black cloud streaked suddenly with fierce lightning.

But, by that blow, Nikumbha was unmoved, recovered soon and grasped the unwieldy bulk of Hanuma. Seeing the mighty Hanuma lifted off the ground in battle, loud roar of exultant joy rose from the ranks of demons. Even though he was being carried off in that way by that demon, Hanuma the son of wind-god, struck him with his thunderbolt-like fist.

Freeing himself from Nikumbha, Hanuma the son of wind-god then threw him down"

http://valmikiramayan.pcriot.com/utf8/yuddha/sarga77/yuddha_77_frame.htm

Conclusion; it is clear that hanutati did not perform as well, he was a eunuch warrior who fails in battles, he ultimately defeated Nikumbh, it is true. But compared to Nila he had to do a lot of labor. Hanuman was even seized and captured in the middle of the fight. That was the opportune moment where Hanuman took Nikumbh by surprise as Nikumbhs hands were focused on keeping hanuman as a prisoner so he could not properly defend himself in case hanuman tries striking him instead of attempting to break free of the grip.

POINT Nila despite fighting nikumbh was never captured but PAJEET hanuman was captured. So Nila scores over hanutati here!

PART 4

hanumana went to lanka alone, nila could not do the same thing"

Debunk - because nila did not need too, if hanumana never existed then someone else would have went to lanka, dont forget that such a huge distance was covered in less time by vibeeshan who left lanka and went to kishkinda, and helped the bridges construction.

And check this link: (http://valmikiramayan.pcriot.com/utf8/kish/sarga65/kishkindha_65_frame.htm) over their Neela was not mentioned. So their is no proof of Hanuman being better than a real man like Nila.

Nila defeated Prahast.

"Then, that huge and terrific rock hurled by Nila the leader of the monkeys broke Prahasa's head into myriad pieces. That Prahasta who lost his breath, was disfigured and dead, bereft of his senses and at once fell on the ground like a tree cut up by the root."

http://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/yuddha/sarga58/yuddha_58_frame.htm

-------

NEXT.

Dwividha & Mainda.

The accolades they got;

"These two illustrious sons of Ashvini Kumaras, Mainda and Dvivida are the foremost among the monkeys. In the battle-field, I do not find anyone who can fight against these two monkeys."

http://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/sundara/sarga59/sundara_59_frame.htm

Their achievement;

"By the pride of those boons, those two heroic monkeys harassed a great army of celestials and thereupon drank up nectar, excited as they were with joy."

http://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/sundara/sarga59/sundara_59_frame.htm

Mainda & Dwividh are better based solely on hanuman's own praise of them and their achievement against high class raksh warriors.

Yupaksha-vadh:

"Mainda, the foremost of monkeys, was enraged and pressed Yupaksha with his arms. Yupaksha fell down dead on the ground."

Shonitaksh-vadh:

"The valiant Dvivida, after splitting open shonitaksha's face with his claws, threw him down on the floor by his strength and crushed him down."

https://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/yuddha/sarga76/yuddha_76_frame.htm

Same bros had this achievement against the vanara dou:

"Those two demons, Shonitaksha and Yupaksha, who were full of violence, carried on a keen contest with the two monkeys in the battle field, by pulling and overthrowing them vehemently and severely."

https://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/yuddha/sarga76/yuddha_76_frame.htm

Dwividh kicked the a$$ of another raksh officer;

"Dvivida, with a mountain-peak, struck down Narantaka, the one among them who was rushing upon quickly and killing the monkeys."

http://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/yuddha/sarga58/yuddha_58_frame.htm

I wish their were more, but unfortunately besides these VANARAS their are none (excluding Vali) that would beat Hanuman in a fight.

------------------

Part b (the non-vanar's).

1] Suparswa.

Sampaati tells them:

"my son who is an enhancer of my gladness pacified me and said this sentence about what has actually happened" "Oh, father, I as a desirer of flesh flew up to skies in time and overspreading the Mt. Mahendra, I very well hovered on it. I have been hovering there looking downward to completely impede the pathway of thousands of underwater beings of the ocean on my own"

"There I have seen someone who in simile is like a shoved heap of mascara and he is going away captivating a lady who equals the aurora in her shine On seeing two of them I resolved to use them up for the purpose of food, but he benignly, basely and beggarly besought way-leave for their traversal There will be none assaulting those that entreat in a beggarly manner, even someone among basely people, isn't it!"

"Then what else is to be said of my kind, aha! He hastily went away as though enshrouding the skies with his vigour, and then the beings that move in the firmament have approached and applauded me.. The great-sages who approached me in firmament have said to me, 'fortunately Seetha is alive, somehow he that Ravana has gone away with Seetha who in fact is to be protected by one and all like you, anyhow your are blest without a doubt..." [4-59-18]

http://valmikiramayan.pcriot.com/utf8/kish/sarga59/kishkindha_59_frame.htm

Suparswas last minute of fame: Though I am aware of the valour of that dirty-minded Ravana, I was rebuking my son saying, 'how you have not saved Maithili? My son has not effectuated my cherish even on hearing the bewail of Seetha, or at least on hearing that Rama and Lakshmana are separated from Seetha, or at least on knowing my friendship with Dasharatha..."

Thus Sampaati spoke to monkeys. [4-63-7b, 8a]

http://valmikiramayan.pcriot.com/utf8/kish/sarga63/kishkindha_63_frame.htm

He made Ravan beg for his life. Something hanutati and ram failed in doing.

2] Jatayu.

His achievement's.

"On winnowing those arrays of arrows with both of his wings, he that highly refulgent Jataayu shattered the mighty bow of Ravana with both of his feet." [3-51-13]
"That highly resplendent lord of birds also blasted off the armour of Ravana, which is glowing and flamelike in its flare, with both of his feet. [3-51-14] Mighty Jataayu also knocked off the ghost-faced mules yoked to the chariot of Ravana which are covered in golden armours and tantivy in fastness." [3-51-15]
"Jataayu swiftly collapsed the parasol of Ravana which in shine is mirroring the full moon, along with the regalia of white-royal-fur-fans, together with the demons handling them for fanning Ravana." [3-51-17]
"Again that highly energetic and imposing king of birds pecked off the robust head of the charioteer of Ravana with beak." [3-51-18]
"Now Ravana who is with his devastated bow, devoid of chariot, dispatched are his horses and departed is his charioteer, and such as he is, he on grabbing Vaidehi by her torso, or, placing her on the lower end of his torso, jumped to earth." [3-51-19]
"Weaponed only with his claws, wings, and beak, Jataayu not only tore the back of Ravana asunder applying his beak and claws, but started to tweeze even his hair." [3-51-35]
"Jataayu, the lord of birds, being a vanquisher of enemies outstripped Ravana and ripped off ten left-arms of Ravana with his beak, with which left arms Ravana is clutching Vaidehi, in order to release her from his clutches." [3-51-38]
http://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/aranya/sarga51/aranya_51_frame.htm

"I outreached to rescue Seetha... and in a combat Ravana is rendered as one with utterly battered chariot... and I felled him and that chariot there... onto earth's surface... [3-67-17]"
"This one is his fragmented bow and this is his fragmented armour... oh, Rama, this is his combat-chariot... which, in combat shattered by me... [3-67-18]"
"This is his charioteer drop dead onto earth by my wings... when I am overtired Ravana gashed my wings and flew skyward taking Seetha of Videha kingdom with him, and it will be inapt of you to kill me who am already killed by the demon."
http://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/aranya/sarga67/aranya_67_frame.htm
He destroyed Ravan's armor, bow, chariot and felled Ravan once. Even killed his charioteer. He was tired so Ravan defeated him but not before the feats of Jatayu.
Jatayu held his own against Ravan:
"That king of eagle Jataayu, who has performed a creditworthy deed of stalling and combating Ravana"
http://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/aranya/sarga68/aranya_68_frame.htm
Jatayu even tore Ravan's arms off he did what Hanuman could never do.

3] Tadka (yakshini).

Quote:

"Flinging up dreadful dust on those two Raghavaa-s, Tataka baffled them for a while with a massive cloud of dust." [1-26-15]

"Then taking hold of witchery she inundated both the Raghava-s with highly torrential stone rain, by which Rama became indignant." [1-26-16]

"That guise changer vanished after variously altering her aspects, and then on baffling them with her illusoriness and discharging stone storms she moved about appallingly." [1-26-19, 20a]

"And on seeing both Rama and Lakshmana who are being overspread by storms of stones from all-over, then the illustrious sage Vishvamitra spoke this sentence." [1-26-20b, 21a]

http://www.valmikiramayan.net/utf8/baala/sarga26/bala_26_frame.htm

4] Wiradh.

"By his might has uplifted Rama and Lakshmana like babies by that might and courage alone, and placed them on his shoulders as one would place babies" "That nightwalker Viradha on placing those two Raghava-s on his shoulders gone towards deeper forest yelling very luridly." [3-3-25]

https://valmikiramayan.pcriot.com/utf8/aranya/sarga3/aranya_3_frame.htm

5] Kabandha.

He beat Laxman;

"Oh, valiant brother, see me, who am out of control on my inner-self, and gone into the control of the demon."

"He that overlong-armed Kabandha outstretching his overlong arms snatched both of the Raghava-s, keeping them side-by-side in his fists, and wringing them with his might."

http://valmikiramayan.pcriot.com/utf8/aranya/sarga69/aranya_69_frame.htm

-------------------

Basic's (final explanation & word of why these people were better than hanuman).

1 - Nila because he fought fairly against prince Nikumbh while hanuman got his ass kicked and cheated later on in their last round, Nila also fights better with Ravan. Nila was never captured by Nikumbh or foot soldier's the way Hanuman was.

2 - Mainda (due to hanuman's own words the praises he sang of this man).

3 - Dwividh (a result of his victory over raksh warriors that fought Angad).

4 - Sugreev (he freed himself from Kumbhkarn, ate his ear's and bloodied him, he even defeated the mighty raksh Prince Kumbha & was praised highly by Laxman).

5 - Angada (he overpowered Meghanad, and put up a better fight against Kumbhkarn than Hanuman ever did).

6 - "Sandhaman" (fought Indra to a standstill and certainly was more well respected among the vanar clan unlike hanumana).

7 - Jatayu (gave Ravan the toughest fight of his life) compared to this guy Hanuman is weak.

8 - Suparswa (this bird made Ravan beg for mercy, quarters etc).

9 - Parshuram (had a vaishnav arrow & experienced in slaughtering warriors with divine weapon's hanuman pailed in comparison to this guy).

10 - "Kabandha" (what to say of the legendary cannibal that defeated laxman and gave Ram a run for his money).

11 - Tadka (the mighty female Yaksha warrior, she encountered the two princes of ayodhya while they were many and she was one, despite the handicap Tadka fought well, due to her magic she can defeat hanuman easy).

12 - Suparswa

13 - Prince Kumbh (son of kumbhkarn) he did defeat 3 vanars better than Hanutati after all.

13 - Many unknown people as even foot soldiers have wounded Hanuman in fight's.

END.

Bonus - why i choose not to include lanka's Rakshasas is simple;

i'll either save them for a future post or choose to talk about them in the comment section.

And to be fair their are way too many rakshasas that were tougher than hanutati.

Since Hanuman is the most overrated character and warrior of indian mythological epics it is time for me to make a few posts that tell the actual truth about this namard. By the way defending him and insulting me for calling him a namard will not do anything for your life or anyone else's. He clearly was not a good person, and was never called a god or avatar or even amsha of Shiva. You can not compare him to any god at all. He is not immune to criticism, he should be exposed and put in his place.

To be even more fair it also debatable on whether the best vanar warrior/fighter was "Sandhaman" or "Vali" i think both were superior to Sugreev but its hard to compare them together.